Tawātur, Ijmāʿ, and Ahl al-Bayt in other madhāhib

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2 years 10 months ago #1257 by ZaydiInquirer
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله

I have a few questions about how the Zaydī madhhab functions amongst the various other madhāhib of Islām.

1. Given that a mutawātir report is transmitted by such a number of individuals that it would be impossible for them to conspire on a forgery, how do the Zaydīs respond to mutawātir reports from other schools that contradict Zaydī beliefs? For example, the Sunnīs have reports such as the ḥadīth "Verily, you will see your Lord just as you see this moon..." or narrations from Imām ʿAlī (عليه السلام) stating that the best of the ummah after the Prophet (صل الله عليه واله وسلم) are Abū Bakr (رضي الله عنه) and ʿUmar (رضي الله عنه). How would Zaydīs justify that these mass transmitted reports are not true?

2. Are all points of ʿaqīdah within Zaydiyyah established by ijmāʿ? e.g. the superiority of Angels over the Prophets, infallibility only referring to protection from major sins, etc. If there are points that are not established by ijmāʿ, is one obliged to reserve their judgement?

3. Is it permissible to follow the Ahl al-Bayt who are followers of other madhāhib in matters where they do not contradict Zaydiyyah, or would it only be allowed to follow them as supporting evidence in matters where they are in agreement with Zaydiyyah, (e.g. the BāʿAlawī Ḥabāʾib in matters of zuhd/taṣawwuf).

جزاكم الله خيرا

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2 years 10 months ago #1260 by Imam Rassi Society
wa alaykum as salaam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu!

Thank you for your questions!

1. Good question! I guess it would depend whether the report actually reaches the status of mass-transmission (tawatur) according to Zaydi standards. This is due to the fact that both tawatur and ijma are pretty subjective as you know. According to Zaydi standards, a report that is considered mutawaatir is when a large number (once again, subjective) of Companions relate the same hadith with non-contradictory wording. In many cases of tawatur, at least in Sunni estimation, a report could be considered mass-transmitted if it has a large number of sub-narrators but the same Companion. Such would not be considered mutawaatir to Zaydis. An example is the Twelve Caliph 'hadith'.

As for the examples you mentioned, Zaydis wouldn't consider such narrations as mutawaatir or even authentic. Allama Majiddiin al-Muayyadi (ra) in one of his treatises mentioned the report "The best of the Ummah..." and said that it is not sahiih because it 'contradicts mutawaatir reports to the contrary that state Imam Ali (as) as the best after the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him and his progeny.' Allama Majiddiin stated such without acknowledging the tawaatur of the report in question. Therefore, it is evident that such report is not considered authentic or mass transmitted.

2. This question is a bit more difficult to answer because we may have an imam state a particular point of aqeeda as being 'the position of the imams of Ahl al-Bayt' without specifying whether there is disagreement from the imams on that issue. One example is the belief in the Punishment of the Grave (adhaab al-qabr). Although we have explicit reports (even in the Majmu Imam Zayd) that support this belief, there are still some scholars who argue contrary to it. Most of these points of disagreement are minor and do not splinter the Zaydis who hold to either view. Those points of belief in which there is legitimate disagreement among our scholars and imams are, as you said, subject to one's own reservation. The reason i say 'legitimate' is because sometimes there could be discrepancies in what is transmitted as an imam's opinion. Case in point: Imam Yahya b. Hamza (as). He is a Zaydi imam who has a collection of treatises that is often use by detractors to demonstrate various views that are considered unorthodox to Zaydis. However, close reading of his entire work show contradiction and even the possibility of interpolation, and even affirm Zaydi orthodoxy.

3. Regarding following those descendants of the Ahl al-Bayt who follow other madhaahib, this would be considered a rather paradoxical understanding because if I were to tell you to follow A and A follows B, wouldn't it make more sense for me to tell you to follow B? The guidance of the Ahl al-Bayt is not relegated to such because the Prophet made them a means of guidance and not other than them. If you find the Prophetic Descendants following someone else in matters of fiqh and aqeeda, one would not apply the principle of Hadith Thaqalayn to support such view. What's even more interesting is that if you were to ask any of the Ba Alawi Habaa`ib about the path of their ancestors, they would readily admit that their ancestors were Zaydis and it was only after Faqih al-Muqaddam that they adopted the Ashari Shafii way.

All of that withstanding, what would be the difference between following a member of Ahl al-Bayt who follows another way and following a non-Ahl al-Bayt who follows another way? The injunction to adhere to the Book and 'Itra applies to the 'Itra who follows the 'Itra. Otherwise, they would be considered the same as anyone else. No offense to the Habaa`ib or any other Sunni Descendant, but Hadith ath-Thaqalayn cannot be used to support them. On the contrary, it would necessitate that they adhere to the understanding of their venerable ancestors.

And Allah knows best!

IRS

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2 years 10 months ago - 2 years 10 months ago #1263 by ZaydiInquirer
جزاك الله خيرا for the answers.

To clarify the issue with tawātur:

If the report is reported from multiple companions, would it still be possible for it to be rejected (e.g. if the chains are weak by Zaydī standards)? The reason for this question is that in Sunnī works, the narrations I referred to have been narrated by multiple companions. For example, the vision of Allāh being likened to the vision of the moon is narrated by 20 companions of the Prophet (صل الله عليه واله وسلم), and the narration about the superiority of Abū Bakr and ʿUmar (رضي الله عنهما) is narrated by even more companions of Imām ʿAlī (عليه السلام). Would these then be rejected based on the weakness of the chains despite their number, or would the fact that they contradict other narrations be sufficient to reject them?

Could I also have a reference for the BāʿAlawīs claiming that al-Faqīh al-Muqaddam or Imām Aḥmad Ibn ʿĪsā converted from Zaydiyyah to Ahl al-Sunnah? I couldn't find anything from them in English that said that, so maybe you know an Arabic reference for their claim.
Last edit: 2 years 10 months ago by ZaydiInquirer.

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2 years 10 months ago #1264 by Imam Rassi Society
Thank you for your responses and questions!

Regarding the status of the aforementioned hadiths, we have explicit references from our sources that identify the report "You will see your Lord..." as being solitary (ahaadi) and not mass-transmitted. Besides, in my own search in Sunni sources, I've identified only three Companions who were said to have related it: Jariir, Abu Hurayra and Abu Sa'id. As for the narration "The best of the Ummah..." we've already addressed it.

So, to answer your question, I don't know if I can answer your question as we have not seen any convincing evidence that the two narrations are mutawaatir, even by Sunni standards. It's possible that the basis of the rejection is the weakness in chains, as you said, or the fact that they contradict the Qur'an as well as mutawaatir narrations.

As for the reference for the BaAlawi claiming that Faqih al-Muqaddam converted from Zaydiyya to Ahl al-Sunnah, I did not get that from a written reference but moreso from verbal statements. Also, i hadn't referenced any written source. I said in the last post "...if you were to ask any of the Ba Alawi Habaa`ib about the path of their ancestors..."

There is an interesting reference in the translation of The Book of Assistance by the Ba Alawi Imam al-Haddad (published by Quilliam Press 1989). Footnote #35 gives a biography of Imam Ahmed b. Isa al-Muhaajir. It says of him:

"He summoned the people to God, established the sunna, and adopted the Shafi'i school of law."


If he 'adopted' the Shafi'i school of law, that would mean that he wasn't a Shafi'i before. Of course, this would beg the question as to what was he before adopting the Shafi'i school. This doesn't prove that he was a Zaydi prior to then; however, it does prove that he was not previously a Shafi'i. If we couple this with the oral history of the Ba Alawis, it would be safe to assume that he was a Zaydi.

And Allah knows best!

IRS

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