12ers going too far
8 years 4 months ago - 8 years 4 months ago #817
by AbuZayn93
12ers going too far was created by AbuZayn93
Salams
When looking into the different schools of thought in Islam, one thing that puts me off the 12er Shia (amongst many things) is I see that a lot of their scholars start attributing qualities of Allah to Ali A.S, and qouting blatant false hadith attributed to their 12 imams. For example I was reading recently in a 12er prayer manual that 'Assalamu Alaykum' in its reality means 'Ali protect you' and they justified this by saying The name of Allah is As'Salam and a name of As'Salam is Ali so therefore Assalamu alaykum means Ali protect you. I also find other falsified hadith from Imam Jafar a.s saying "Allah told the prophet that if it was not for Ali he would not have even created the earth".
I find such statements a contradictory to the message of Islam, as Islam is to worship Allah.
After my research I do believe that the Zaidia are the true and origonal Shia of Ali a.s, and that 12er shiism has been influenced by persian paganism amongst other things, but I would like to ask, Do the Zaydiyyah also agree with such statements that seem to give Ali a.s a sort of share in godly powers with the creator?
Thanks!
When looking into the different schools of thought in Islam, one thing that puts me off the 12er Shia (amongst many things) is I see that a lot of their scholars start attributing qualities of Allah to Ali A.S, and qouting blatant false hadith attributed to their 12 imams. For example I was reading recently in a 12er prayer manual that 'Assalamu Alaykum' in its reality means 'Ali protect you' and they justified this by saying The name of Allah is As'Salam and a name of As'Salam is Ali so therefore Assalamu alaykum means Ali protect you. I also find other falsified hadith from Imam Jafar a.s saying "Allah told the prophet that if it was not for Ali he would not have even created the earth".
I find such statements a contradictory to the message of Islam, as Islam is to worship Allah.
After my research I do believe that the Zaidia are the true and origonal Shia of Ali a.s, and that 12er shiism has been influenced by persian paganism amongst other things, but I would like to ask, Do the Zaydiyyah also agree with such statements that seem to give Ali a.s a sort of share in godly powers with the creator?
Thanks!
Last edit: 8 years 4 months ago by AbuZayn93.
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8 years 4 months ago - 8 years 4 months ago #824
by Imam Rassi Society
Replied by Imam Rassi Society on topic 12ers going too far
Salams!
Thank you for your question! Alhmadulillah, I can say that with my experience and readings of Zaydi aqeeda and hadith literature, I have never found anything that would suggest the worship of any imam. From the beginning, our imams have always sought to distance themselves from the extremists among the Shias. Imam ar-Rassi (as), one of our earliest dogmatists, wrote on deviant Shia sects/beliefs and even has a treatise called Refutation of the Extremist Raafida. In his works, he highlights those beliefs he deems extremist and idolatrous and seeks to refute them.
To be fair, I would doubt that most of the everyday common 12er Shia hold to such beliefs although some of these things may be suggested in their literature. One must also account for the fact that just because these things are in their literature, it doesn't mean that they believe such things. It's possible that some of their scholars weakened these narrations or denied their authenticity altogether. The presence of such things in their literature has been problematic for them though.
What many fail to acknowledge is that much of 12er thought has evolved and developed over time. That is maybe one of the reasons why they tend to defer more to contemporary scholars and thinkers rather than 'classical' Shia scholars.
And Allah knows best!
IRS
Thank you for your question! Alhmadulillah, I can say that with my experience and readings of Zaydi aqeeda and hadith literature, I have never found anything that would suggest the worship of any imam. From the beginning, our imams have always sought to distance themselves from the extremists among the Shias. Imam ar-Rassi (as), one of our earliest dogmatists, wrote on deviant Shia sects/beliefs and even has a treatise called Refutation of the Extremist Raafida. In his works, he highlights those beliefs he deems extremist and idolatrous and seeks to refute them.
To be fair, I would doubt that most of the everyday common 12er Shia hold to such beliefs although some of these things may be suggested in their literature. One must also account for the fact that just because these things are in their literature, it doesn't mean that they believe such things. It's possible that some of their scholars weakened these narrations or denied their authenticity altogether. The presence of such things in their literature has been problematic for them though.
What many fail to acknowledge is that much of 12er thought has evolved and developed over time. That is maybe one of the reasons why they tend to defer more to contemporary scholars and thinkers rather than 'classical' Shia scholars.
And Allah knows best!
IRS
Last edit: 8 years 4 months ago by Imam Rassi Society.
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8 years 4 months ago #831
by Sayyed Rafidhi
Replied by Sayyed Rafidhi on topic 12ers going too far
Salamu alaikom
Is there a pdf available for the book you mentioned? Arabic or english will be fine InshaAllah.
Is there a pdf available for the book you mentioned? Arabic or english will be fine InshaAllah.
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8 years 4 months ago #834
by AbuZayn93
Replied by AbuZayn93 on topic 12ers going too far
Wa alaykum salam
It was a childrens 12er jafari prayer book i happened to find a PDF for, one that is normally tought in Madrasa, im sorry I dont remember the EXACT name but it was on google some where
It was a childrens 12er jafari prayer book i happened to find a PDF for, one that is normally tought in Madrasa, im sorry I dont remember the EXACT name but it was on google some where
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8 years 4 months ago #835
by AbuZayn93
Replied by AbuZayn93 on topic 12ers going too far
Salams!
Thanks for your response! This is good to hear. I can whole heartidly say the Zaidi Madhab is very balanced in its approach! I am enjoying my research into the madhab and am impressed so far
Thanks for your response! This is good to hear. I can whole heartidly say the Zaidi Madhab is very balanced in its approach! I am enjoying my research into the madhab and am impressed so far
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8 years 4 months ago - 8 years 4 months ago #847
by Imam Rassi Society
Replied by Imam Rassi Society on topic 12ers going too far
wa alayakum as salaam wa rahma!
The aforementioned treatise is in the Majmu' Imam al-Qaasim ar-Rassi (as). It is available for download here .
And Allah knows best!
IRS
The aforementioned treatise is in the Majmu' Imam al-Qaasim ar-Rassi (as). It is available for download here .
And Allah knows best!
IRS
Last edit: 8 years 4 months ago by Imam Rassi Society.
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